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Ludum Dare 30 — August 22nd-25th 2014 — Theme: Connected Worlds
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    Ludum Dare 20 Results!

    Posted by (twitter: @ludumdare)
    May 23rd, 2011 6:56 pm

    It’s been a long 3 weeks for some, but Ludum Dare 20 has finally ended.

    Here are your results:

    Top 20 Competition Games

    You can check out the top 20 competition games here (including ties):

    http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/ludum-dare-20/?action=top

    Winners are decided by the Overall category. To see the complete list, hit the “Show All Entries” link at the bottom.

    Categorical Top 5′s

    Here at Ludum Dare, being the best game isn’t the only way to win. Games are rated in 7 additional categories, with a special “Coolness” category highlighting people that went above and beyond to be sure you got a vote.

    http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/ludum-dare-20/

    *NOTE*: You can click on the titles of the categories for Top 20 style lists per category.

    More Great Games from the Jam!

    The Jam is huge – simple as that. With 64 games this time, the Jam is now larger than some of the earlier Ludum Dare events. I regret that we still don’t do more for the jammers, but don’t fret, we are thinking of you. We’d like to encourage everyone to check out the Jam games, and leave a comment. Here are four to get you started:

    Rainbow Riding Hoodz by Mr_Hk_ and team

    Tri by ratking

    Lonely Fortress by Winterblood

    Again, this is just a taste of some of the great games to be found in the Jam.

    See them all here:

    ALL JAM GAMES (64) <--

    Seriously, go check them out!

    More Ludum Dare 20 links

    - Keynote!, with Sos
    - Theme Voting Results
    - Entry counts in the final minutes, by me
    - Wallpaper of all entries, by ExciteMike

    Interesting Tags: montage, motivation, foodphoto, food, deskphoto, desk, timelapse

    IndieGames.com’s 250 Indie Games You Must Play

    Editor of IndieGames.com Michael Rose has recently released his new book “250 Indie Games You Must Play”. I know we’re a pretty significant source of great freebies and not-so-freebies (see the featured games in the sidebar), so I fired off a question last night: Did any Ludum Dare games make the book?

    Mike had this to say:

    Yep, quite a number [of times] actually :)

    We here at Ludum Dare love talking about ourselves, and though we may not have coffee tables to prominently show a book on, coffee is a significant source of caffeine, so I’m sold.

    Visit your favorite Amazon and pick it up.

    Ludum Dare breaks 2000 on Twitter!

    As the organizers, Phil and I tend to amuse ourselves each event with little statistics to gauge the growth of the community. One I’ve been keeping a close eye on for LD20 is our twitter follower count. Early this morning, the @ludumdare twitter account finally broke 2000 followers! Wow!

    We use the twitter account as a way to share little updates. Reminders, press coverage, and the occasional amusing quip we catch in the Twitterverse or on IRC. If you’re in to that sort of thing, and do the twitter thang, follow us!

    Also if you haven’t already, sign up for the mailing list. Even if you do hound twitter reading each and every post, we make an effort to get the most important news to you via e-mail too.

    Ludum Dare 21 – Coming August 2011!!

    Like usual, stop by again in August for our next regularly scheduled event. We’ll try to have a date nailed down a month or two ahead of time. Don’t forget the mailing list, and Twitter.

    May Mini LD #26, hosted by drZool

    I agree, August is quite a ways away. How about this weekend then? Yes, tune in Friday for a brand new MiniLD event hosted by drZool. He’s been teasing with D’s all month… I wonder what he’s up to?

    Suggestions

    If you have any suggestions for us (website, observations, etc), we continue to collect them in the comments here:

    http://www.ludumdare.com/compo/2009/08/30/suggestion-post/

    Thanks everyone for coming out and making Ludum Dare 20 such a big success! We’ll see you again in August!

    - Mike Kasprzak (PoV)

    28 Responses to “Ludum Dare 20 Results!”

    1. thristhart says:

      I gotta admit, I’m pretty confused as to why I got a rating of straight 1′s on my entry. Looking around, I’ve spotted a few other entries with a line of undeserved (imo) 1 ratings in every category. Did someone go around and just downvote other people’s games?

      • moltanem2000 says:

        I got the same thing. Someone’s been trollin

      • matthias_zarzecki says:

        Well, if everybody got a round of 1s, nothing has changed :-)

        • Fizzik says:

          Actually, the difference between a game getting 20 ratings with some being trolls, compared to a game with 100+ ratings with some being trolls, is so obsurdly huge that a single troll can obliterate a game’s rating.

        • matthias_zarzecki says:

          Also, If you look closely, you will see, that besides the row of 1s everybody got a row of 5s.

      • eld says:

        Had that issues, got a complete 1 vote from someone, got votes on AUDIO even though I don’t have audio, got low scores to high scores or even passes on community even though I made sure to post entries and post mortem’d it.

      • Grungi Ankhfire says:

        Maybe the growing size of the LD community asks for some more constraints on the voting process ? I don’t have a definite solution to propose, but from the top of my head :

        - Ask for a remark of X characters to go along with the rating (or the rating for each category, even). Would ask some more efforts from the trolls. And may even yields way to discard their votes;
        - Add a “reporting” period at the end of the voting process. If enough people reports lines of ’1′ or ’5′ or things like this, and say at least 10 or 15 belong to the same user, automatically remove this user’s vote from the db.

        Those are two (probably bad) ideas that just came to me. The point is that now LD has become something quite big, and that increases the chances of trolling, unfortunately. As nice as it would be to have a self-regulated community, I’m afraid it’s not always possible…

        That said, congrats everyone :D

        • Martoon says:

          The “all 1s” trolling happened a lot in LD18 for some reason. My entry got hit with two of these lines of 1s (out of 10 people voting), which completely destroyed my averages (the other votes were giving me 3s, 4s and 5s). Several other people got hit, too. In LD19 I was more fortunate and didn’t get any troll votes, so my averages were much better (even scored a medal! :) ).

          I really think the solution is to have a table like this in each user’s public profile:


          Inn Fun The Gra Aud Hum Ove Com
          (1) 4 2 6 2 3 9 8 12
          (2) 1 4 3 2 2 2 2 2
          (3) 9 2 3 1 3 1 2 3
          (4) 2 1 5 7 3 1 9 1
          (5) 3 7 2 9 2 0 1 8

          In this (completely random) example, you can see that this user gave a total of six 1s in the Theme category, a total of three 4s in the Graphics category, etc. The voting is still anonymous, because we don’t know which games she gave which numbers to (or even which games she voted on). But a trolling voter would show a high number of 1s in all categories and zero everything else. I think this would seriously cut down on, if not completely eliminate, troll voting.

          • Martoon says:

            Doh! I thought the code tag would give fixed-width spaces. Oh well. Just pretend the number columns match up to the headings in the “table” above.

          • bluescrn says:

            The LD scoring/rating system just isn’t working amazingly well any more. It was great in early LD48s, with a much smaller number of entries, more of them being ‘really from scratch’ (no Unity, mot much Flash – in the pre-Flashpunk era) to set a real baseline.

            Many entrants (myself included sometimes) often rating very few games or none at all, for whatever reason. Including just not wanting to give low scores, or struggling to give a game a fair 1-5 rating in any/all categories. Or people downvoting because ‘didn’t work on my PC/didn’t support Linux/ran too slow on my ancient netbook’…

            People play the games with the most ratings – assuming that they’re the good ones, detracting from all the others. I know I’ve done it, and it’s obvious that others do the same – ‘ooh, that’s got way more votes, it must be interesting!’

            Worse still, people voting badly to get their ‘coolness’ score up… or the signs of tactical downvoting/trollvoting, which is sad to see at Ludum Dare :(

            In future, I think I’ll just join the Jam. I’ve had some great results the earlier days of Ludum Dare, but my generally oldschool approach just can’t compete with some of the awesome stuff people are coming up with these days :)

            • Shadow says:

              “People play the games with the most ratings – assuming that they’re the good ones, detracting from all the others. I know I’ve done it, and it’s obvious that others do the same – ‘ooh, that’s got way more votes, it must be interesting!’”

              I think that’s another thing that must be addressed. But this one is fairly easy to solve. They just need to hide the votes each game is getting, so that info is unknown until the very end of the process.

              • ACodeGerm says:

                This right here.

                I’m guilty of using votes as a quick way to find the best games to play as well.

                If anything, implement this.

              • MrDude says:

                I actually pick games based on how interesting they look. I confess, I don’t play too many, but I do pick out the ones that look interesting…

                I guess my point is that not everyone uses the number of votes.

              • thristhart says:

                On the flip side, I use the number of votes to determine which to play – I play the ones that have been voted the least. They’re the ones that need my input, after all.

    2. 7Soul says:

      And why you guys didn’t implement the new voting categories this time? Will it be there for LD21?

    3. SonnyBone says:

      Yeah I got the solid 1s as well. Looks like I had less votes on this game than all of my previous entries, too. I’ll need to verify that and see what happened. It’s late and I’m super tired, but congrats to everyone! I’ll check this out in detail tomorrow!

    4. Winterblood says:

      A well-deserved win for Deepnight, congratulations. I’ll be passing around the link to Appy1000mg for some time…
      And thanks for featuring my jam effort!

    5. [...] Les résultats du dernier Ludum viennent de tomber, un gros bravo à notre Deepnight national qui rafle pour la 2eme fois de suite le titre de champion ! [...]

    6. Nyaa says:

      Oh wow! Congratulations to everyone who entered and mega-congratulations to others in the top 20. Re: trolls leaving straight 1′s for people – GRRRR, that’s so childish and smacks of confidence issues :/

    7. Endurion says:

      Congrats to everybody participating and also the hoster group :)
      LD has gone a long way from the first 24h contest to this.

      I’d like to have some things fixed:
      O Having links without http:// in front removed is nasty. Better to check for and automatically prepend it.
      O Filename rules. Seriously. After batch downloading you have 20 files named LD20_This.zip. Great.

      I think there has to be some voting change. The sheer amount is overwhelming. The randomizing helps but there’s still a unfair bias towards prettier games. Only allow voting on other entries (and see their screens) once you voted on your 20 list or something. On the other hand, forcing vote may be scaring people away as well.

      • Grungi Ankhfire says:

        Only problem with locking the list until you’ve voted for everything is that it would prevent some people to rate even if they want to. I’m on linux, and all the Unity3D/XNA/.NET games are out of my reach. I did my best and rated about 13 games from my initial list, but then I took the full list and worked from the bottom and tried to get as high as possible.

        What could be a good idea is a way to mark a game as “cannot play” with a field for entering the reason. It could be either posted anounymously (or not) as a comment, or disclosed together with the results, at least providing some insight after the fact. But the game would be at least counted as “rated” for the guy trying it out.

        It seems a bit unfair that you HAVE to be on Windows to be able to go for a good Coolness rating, I must say… :)

    8. ratking says:

      Thanks for mentioning “Tri” (with screenshot)! I was sad when I changed from Compo to Jam, but this countervails it. :)

    9. Cosr says:

      Thank you for mentioning my jam game, sirs. It makes me feel all sorts of special.

    10. Shadow says:

      Didn’t participate in the Compo but I think the trollvoting issue must be addressed. It could help to limit the number of entries a given user can rate, let’s say, max. 20 games. Most people won’t take the time to play more than 10-20 games (I think). With the things as they are now, any participant can easily go and downvote all other entries without actually playing them, just to ensure to get a better rating for his/her game.
      By restricting the number of entries a user can judge, we are minimizing the impact of his/her trolling. Problem is that, at the same time, we are also affecting people who genuinously play tons of games and give honest votes to them (it would be interesting to find out the average and max. number of games a single user rates per LD, maybe it’s not that bad of a idea).

      Another (but more complex mechanism) is to set a timer (stored in DB to avoid cookie hacks perhaps?) so, if a user wants to rate a game, he/she must first download it first (that’s where the counter starts). He/she will only be able to submit a vote for that game after at least 10 minutes (or something like that) since the download started. This will discourage trollvoting. The only disadvantage of this method is that if the game can be completed in less than the defined time, the user will have to wait to give his/her rating and may desist from voting (because we all hate to wait).

      Another possible solution would be to demand a comment of at least a few chars if a rating of 1 star is given, so the user must provide an explanation of why the game deserved such a low score. Those cases would be then evaluated by LD staff to check if they are fair votes.

      A last resort option is to make the voting process non-anonymous. We all know the power of trolls comes from Anonymity.

      And now I’m out of ideas, i think I’ll keep thinking on the issue, but I REALLY think it must be addressed somehow. Maybe the LD staff could setup a little voting poll about the mechanism to use and if the issue should be addressed at all.

    11. localcoder says:

      The big websites are careful to never reward destructive behaviour.

      Amazon.com doesn’t reward you for writing reviews – that would encourage spam. Instead, it rewards you for writing reviews that other users find helpful.

      On Stackoverflow, you don’t get points for answering questions – because that would encourage spam – you only get points for writing answers that get upvoted.

      Amy Jo Kim has some great talks about this kind of thing. But basically, the key is:

      1) What makes a good Ludum Dare Judge?

      2) How can you give points to good Judges, and not to bad Judges?

    12. sfernald says:

      I would say the only fair thing is to make the judging completely separate from the competition. If you enter the contest, you shouldn’t be allowed to judge, it is that simple. What worked with 50-100 contestants is not going to work with 500-1000 or more contestants. And some point human nature takes over and you get the bias and the down-votes.

      Ideally, all entries should be anonymous and the judges should be professional, highly-ethical reviewers.

      Of course how that can be implemented I haven’t a clue!

    13. [...] Hammer Dig was conceived and built within 48 hours, as part of Ludlum Dare’s 20th design competition, the theme being “It’s dangerous to go alone! Take this!” With a complete set of [...]

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